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  #221  
Old 01-02-2014, 10:50 AM
Kelly Meyer Kelly Meyer is offline
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I can answer the Apache trout questions, and the gila trout questions in Region 1. Mike Anderson is a better source for other questions. Track record on Apaches in the last 20 years.

Nine streams renovated and restocked.

three streams unsuitable due to small size and poor habitat for self sustaining population. Never be much of sports fishery anyway. Lee Valley, Hayground and Stinky. Hayground and Stinky will be useful for recovery, as it will get transient moving into the stream in wet cycles. it will be part of the recovery area in the future. The trend on these streams are not good if it keeps getting dryer.

Two streams with reproduction wild fish and open for fishing. West Fork Black (Catch and release), West Fork LCR (general fishing). Both reopened immediely after renovation, as stocked with wild fish and hatchery fish.

One stream to be reopened soon. East Fork LCR. Reproduction, will propose for reopening in next reg cycle with catch and release fishing. Caught people in there poaching so time to reopen.

Two streams had reproduction would have been reopened except for Wallow Fire. Fish Creek and South Fork LCR. Great year classes. Fish Creek may never be suitable as the barrier was completely obliterated. South Fork the barrier held up but there was heavy mortality from the ash flow, impaired spawning from silt for 6 years so there is no timeline on this stream reopening. Both these stream would have had no fishing due to the fire regardless of managagement.

One stream still needed barrier work before reopening. Bear Wallow. reproduction, barrier issues. This stream also lost almost all fish due to the fire. Would have not had fishing regardless of management due to fire effects. However, this stream was not doing well as the barrier was passing fish. Scheduled to get barrier repaired.

The conssistent message with this management is that these fish did well in great streams. In every stream with suitable habitat they did well and if not for the Wallow Fire we would have five great streams to catch wild Apache trout. By 2015 even with the fire we should have three.

On another note. West Fork LCR is doing very well with reproduction. Stocked catchable trout in streams very rarely make it to the next year regardless of species. The reproduction is taking place in reaches above the stocked area by wild trout. Go to the wilderness area and fish upstream if you want to catch wild Apaches.
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  #222  
Old 01-02-2014, 11:06 AM
BamaRon BamaRon is offline
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Again, what's the status of Frye Creek?
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  #223  
Old 01-03-2014, 12:33 AM
WMF WMF is offline
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Thank you Kelly.
In short: 20 years, 2 fishable streams, 9 total streams poisoned (sorry "renovated" is pure wordsmith)? From reading a bit I see that 7 streams were poisoned on USFS lands from 1962-1969, then 13 more have been poisoned between 1981 and 2008. So 1962 to present (50 years give or take) and 20 streams later we have 2 fishable streams?

On the East Fork LCR did you site the poachers?

Thanks again.
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Last edited by WMF; 01-03-2014 at 12:44 AM. Reason: added data..
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  #224  
Old 01-03-2014, 06:53 AM
BamaRon BamaRon is offline
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Jeremy,

Thanks again for the crusty old video of Gila Trout fry in Frye Creek. When will Frye Creek be fishable?

Last edited by BamaRon; 01-03-2014 at 06:54 AM. Reason: Name
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  #225  
Old 01-03-2014, 10:39 AM
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Fly Chef Fly Chef is offline
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Glad you guys can read, several of the streams were destroyed by a human caused fire - if not they would most likely be fishable - and it would not matter it they were browns, 'bows, brookies, or even frickin' sharks.

Love the positive open-mindedness of some people on this site. Might as well be Bud swillin' worm fishermen.
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  #226  
Old 01-03-2014, 10:56 AM
Jeremy V Jeremy V is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BamaRon View Post
Jeremy,

Thanks again for the crusty old video of Gila Trout fry in Frye Creek. When will Frye Creek be fishable?
Sorry for not addressing this question sooner. Wasn't on much the past few days...

Frye Creek will be opened to angling when the Arizona Game and Fish Commission approves it. When will that happen? I don't know. I would hope if surveys in 2014 show continued growth, reproduction, and population expansion, it'll be sooner rather than later. And remember, Frye was fishless due to a fire from many years ago, so it's not like angling opportunity was lost there waiting for it to be opened to Gila trout angling.
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  #227  
Old 01-03-2014, 11:00 AM
BamaRon BamaRon is offline
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Originally Posted by Fly Chef View Post
"Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing it is not the fish they are after". - Henry David Thoreau.
"And manly men go fishing, knowing that when they're fishing it's the fish they're after. There's ample time for self-absorbed navel contemplation back home on the couch". - BamaRon

Thoreau was a freeloading left-of-center extremist; his cabin was only a few feet from his mommy's house, and mommy cooked for him and did all his laundry.
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  #228  
Old 01-03-2014, 11:09 AM
BamaRon BamaRon is offline
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Originally Posted by Jeremy V View Post
And remember, Frye was fishless due to a fire from many years ago, so it's not like angling opportunity was lost there waiting for it to be opened to Gila trout angling.
Thanks for the reply. So when did the Frye Creek Gila stocking program officially begin?

As for "it's not like angling opportunity was lost" because of the fire many years ago, hypothetically Brown and/or Rainbow trout could have been stocked in Frye Creek (the state has/did stock Brown trout in Canyon Creek) and I suspect anglers would be fishing Frye Creek by now for Browns/Rainbows.

I keep reading how hardy, temperature and drought resistant Gila trout are. For a native trout that is so hardy, so adapted to its Arizona watersheds, it sure is fragile.

Last edited by BamaRon; 01-03-2014 at 11:47 AM. Reason: grammer
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  #229  
Old 01-03-2014, 05:48 PM
WMF WMF is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fly Chef View Post
Glad you guys can read, several of the streams were destroyed by a human caused fire - if not they would most likely be fishable - and it would not matter it they were browns, 'bows, brookies, or even frickin' sharks.

Love the positive open-mindedness of some people on this site. Might as well be Bud swillin' worm fishermen.
So you're better than " bud swillin worm fishermen"? What if I do drink Bud and dunk worms? You're beyond that, intellectually superior? Perhaps you're economically beyond my means?
I shouldn't be open minded to bad ideas, its the first rule in logic. I have an opinion on this, I have read about it, thought about it and find it lacking in scientific data, as well as common sense. I can express this opinion, and even though it is contrary to some I don't need to attempt to degrade them. I will ask difficult questions and point out facts that are not properly represented. If this upsets you counter with something data driven in an intelligence manner.
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  #230  
Old 03-19-2014, 03:57 PM
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osteen osteen is offline
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I just read most of the posts in this thread, and wish I could somehow have that half hour of my life back. Hopefully you will all someday solve the mystery of who is smarter, who catches more fish, who has discovered the deep mysteries of trout fishing, who can **** further, etc. etc. In the mean time, I will be busy ACTUALLY FISHING.

Does anyone have any real information on this topic?

Has Haigler been poisoned yet?
Is fishing it a waste of time this weekend?
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